Please get pleasure from this transcript of a unique type of episode, the place I’m within the sizzling seat. Dan Harris (@danharris) interviewed me for his present, the 10% Happier with Dan Harris podcast, and I assumed it was value sharing right here. We cowl my most up-to-date mind stimulation protocol, the place I’ve landed on optimization, and avoiding traps of self-help. Dan is an excellent interviewer. He’s the bestselling writer of 10% Happier and Meditation for Fidgety Skeptics: A ten% Happier How-To E book.
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Tim Ferriss — The way to Quiet the Ruminative Thoughts, Keep away from Traps of Self-Assist, and Focus in a World of Promiscuous Overcommitment
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Dan Harris: Tim Ferriss, welcome again to the present.
Tim Ferriss: Thanks, sir. Good to be again. Good to see you.
Dan Harris: Likewise. Let me ask you a ridiculously fundamental query, however I feel perhaps deceptively easy. I truly by no means know say, is it deceptively advanced or deceptively easy? Anyway, my query actually is how are you? How are you doing as of late? You’ve publicly type of gone on a trip speaking about your personal stuff, a few of it fairly heavy. I’m simply curious, how are you?
Tim Ferriss: That could be a each deceptively easy and complicated query. My reply fortunately is actually easy, higher than ever. I really feel completely unbelievable. We may dive into how and why that’s the case for those who’d like, however I’d say preserving it quick and candy for the second, I’d say unbelievable, higher than ever, thoughts, physique, soul, psycho-emotionally, musculoskeletally, actually feeling holistically excellent, optimistic, we may preserve going, so I’ll allow you to take that wherever you’d wish to.
Dan Harris: I like to listen to it. Critically, I actually do love to listen to it and I’d be curious to observe up and listen to from you want what has introduced you so far?
Tim Ferriss: Yeah, I’d say a number of issues. So, one of many dangers of non-public growth, or let’s simply name it extra broadly self-help, is that it might very simply change into self-infatuation or self-obsession.
Dan Harris: Yeah.
Tim Ferriss: And the counterbalance to that, the guess that offsets it’s it’s quite simple. Relationships, actually doubling down, tripling down on relationships. We’re advanced to be a social species, and each time you might be in isolation bodily or just in thought loops in your personal head, that tends to catalyze or worsen tremendously any sort of instability or OCD or melancholy or nervousness or fill-in-the-blank psychiatric situation. So, my insurance policies, which had been already in place final time we spoke that I’ve actually continued to speculate into are doing a previous yr overview yearly, taking a look at my prime relationships which can be nourishing, energizing vitality in versus vitality out, after which blocking out time prematurely for all the yr for prolonged durations of time with these individuals. Now prolonged will rely in your circumstances. For me, that may very well be wherever from a protracted weekend to per week spending say 5 days within the wilderness in Montana with a few of my oldest closest associates, et cetera, et cetera.
That can do — to not denigrate remedy in any means — however generally speaking extra about your issues, if it had been to unravel all your issues, would’ve labored already. There’s a spot for discuss remedy, however it’s not, nor does it must be the one software within the toolkits. So, merely spending time round your foolish, dumb, wonderful associates and laughing, whether or not it’s round a bottle of wine or a meal or a campfire, actually, actually goes a good distance. So, that’s one piece of it. Second piece is to hit a well-recognized thread may be very constant meditation usually twice each day, 10 minutes, very, very easy in my case.
After which additionally if we’re going out to the perimeters a bit technologically talking, there’s something that a few of your listeners might have by no means heard of, which is accelerated TMS. TMS stands for transcranial magnetic stimulation. It’s a sort of mind stimulation that has existed for many years, however the {hardware} and the software program, all the pieces about these applied sciences has improved dramatically within the final 5 to 10 years, notably in I’d say the final 5 years.
Due to sure researchers like Nolan Williams out of Stanford, who sadly handed away within the final six months and others. However what accelerated TMS seems to be like is usually as much as, let’s simply name it perhaps one or two years in the past, accelerated TMS takes what you may do in standard TMS over a number of months the place you go in, you may have this paddle put towards your head, it produces a magnetic discipline that simply to maintain it quite simple, both excites or inhibits sure components of your mind, sure kinds of circuitry, and that may be utilized to melancholy, it may be utilized to neurodegenerative illnesses. The truth is, in some circumstances it may be utilized to nervousness, OCD and so forth, relying on the goal the place you place these coils. And within the case of accelerated TMS, you’re taking what you may do over three, 4, 5 months and also you’re compressing it into one week.
So, each hour on the hour, 10 hours a day for one week, you’re getting into and getting, let’s simply name it a couple of minutes, three to 9 minutes of pulses in your mind, and then you definately take 50 minutes off, you return in, you get hit once more, and that has been referred to at the least in a single format. The SAINT Protocol S-A-I-N-T, they’ve shied away from it, however it was developed at Stanford and the SAINT Protocol in lots of, let’s name them sufferers, produces 70%, 80% remission of melancholy. That’s fairly sturdy. It’s not one shot you’re executed. Sometimes, individuals will, let’s simply say do a five-day sequence, then they could go in and have one to three-day booster sequences three months, six months later. And this expertise has large results. I’ve experimented with this over the past handful of years. The primary time I did it, it had close to miraculous outcomes.
I went from having extreme and I’ve been formally recognized, so this isn’t simply throwing it round loosely, however average, extreme OCD with a lot of rumination. I’m not flipping mild switches or washing my arms, however I’ve these ruminative loops that I get caught in. Folks I’m positive some listening can establish with this the place you simply can’t flip off these type of compulsive thought loops. Might be a grudge, may very well be a concern, may very well be one thing you’re planning for, may very well be a dialog you want to have. It simply loops and loops and loops, which causes insomnia, which causes fatigue and simply basic carrying down of the system, which ends up in melancholy. I’ve realized that’s my sequence. It truly begins with nervousness, not melancholy out of the gate. And I used to be having, let’s simply name it seven, eight out of 10 signs once I went in to the primary remedy, I did a 5 days that’s actually extreme for people who find themselves not clear.
It’s actually, actually extreme. It’s affecting each facet of my life. Had the remedy, there was a delayed onset and even the scientists most concerned with this don’t actually have an amazing clarification for the way or why this might occur, however nothing actually occurred for 2, three weeks after which flipped a change and had mainly zero nervousness, zero rumination for, let’s name it three to 4 months. I’ve by no means skilled something prefer it. And that features psychedelic assisted therapies, which I do know very properly and have supported a variety of science underlying. It is a little bit of a protracted reply I notice, however for people who find themselves , I actually advocate the dialog I did with Nolan Williams. Then there are several types of {hardware}, however I attempted it then with boosters a number of instances afterwards. Null impact, zero, didn’t work.
And I began to lose hope once more as a result of I assumed this was going to be a replicable, dependable software that I may use. I used to be so excited and did a Hail Mary type of final ditch spherical with the accelerated TMS not too long ago. I did this in Northern California as a substitute of doing 5 days. So, take into account, it’s like, let’s simply name it three months of TMS will get compressed into 5 days. As an alternative of doing 5 days, I did at some point, however I pre-dosed with one thing referred to as D-cycloserine, DCS, because it’s generally referred to within the literature, is in some ways an antiquated antibiotic that was once used for tuberculosis and generally urinary tract infections, which impacts the NMDA receptors in such a means. I feel it’s a partial antagonist, it could be an agonist, so don’t quote me on it, however the level is that this little drug that isn’t usually used anymore is a catalyst for neuroplasticity.
And once you take this beforehand, you are able to do one thing like at some point of accelerated TMS and generally the outcomes are higher than what you beforehand, let’s simply name it seven years in the past, would get from three, 4 months. And I did at some point and Dan this time round, it was identical to a change mainly the subsequent day and it has now been two or three months, and I don’t wish to set expectations that it’ll be this fashion for everybody. It appears to be notably efficient, sure for melancholy, however it appears to be notably efficient in a really small pattern dimension at this level for nervousness and OCD and it’s only a completely different life. It’s a completely different life.
So, all of these issues together plus the fundamentals, proper? The type of fundamental macronutrients of well being, train, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera, food plan and so forth, are simply doing their job collectively. The final one I’ll throw in after which I’ll shut up as a result of I notice this has changed into a TED Speak, is intermittent ketosis. So, the ketogenic food plan and ketosis general, which will be achieved a number of other ways, which I’m in proper now, is completely phenomenal for addressing a variety of psychiatric pains, psychoemotional pains which can be failing to be handled by medicine. And there’s one thing referred to as metabolic psychiatry. Chris Palmer out of Harvard and others have checked out this very carefully. All proper, thanks for coming to my TED Speak.
Dan Harris: I simply wish to guarantee you, TED Talks are welcome right here. You’re a podcaster, you already know lengthy solutions are high quality. So, please delete that sheepishness out of your thoughts.
Tim Ferriss: All proper, will do.
Dan Harris: I’ve 1,000,000 follow-up questions. Let me simply say simply excessive degree, a unique life, these three phrases actually did make me very blissful to listen to that that’s what’s occurring for you.
Tim Ferriss: Thanks, Dan. Yeah, it’s not possible to overstate the distinction between an eight out of 10 of continuous ruminative monkey thoughts with a fixation on issues which can be anxiety-producing to attending to a one or two out of 10. These are two completely different lived experiences. They’re to this point aside from one another. It’s actually outstanding.
Dan Harris: So that you talked about transcranial, is it magnetic stimulation, TMS?
Tim Ferriss: Magnetic stimulation. Mm-hmm.
Dan Harris: I’ll drop a hyperlink within the present notes for individuals who wish to take heed to Tim’s dialog with Nolan Williams, with the caveat after all that you just’re not the researcher, the world’s main professional, you’re extra of the Guinea pig and affected person. However are you able to inform us a bit bit extra about is TMS extensively obtainable? Is it a factor that common individuals can entry and in addition how sturdy is the proof?
Tim Ferriss: All proper, I’m blissful to deal with that with, as you mentioned, the disclaimer, I’m not a health care provider, nor do I play one on the web, however I do spend a variety of time in these waters. So, what I’ll say is that the proof for TMS broadly, they’re many years of proof with completely different purposes of TMS. As we have a look at accelerated TMS, there’s truly I’d say very compelling physique of proof. As soon as we get into the vanguard, which is at all times dangerous, proper? You don’t essentially wish to be one of many first 100 monkeys shot within the area, however on this explicit case, the ache was nice sufficient that I made a decision to opt-in. Then you definately’re moving into the bleeding edge, which is that this D-Cycloserine, DCS plus TMS. That’s very a lot on the outer reaches. I’d say at the least based mostly on the clinic that I went to, and perhaps general for all I do know I’m one in every of maybe 60 sufferers with OCD/generalized nervousness dysfunction who’ve been handled that means. So, it’s a really small quantity.
By way of accessibility, there are, let me begin from the highest in no explicit order, however I’ll simply say that there’s a {hardware} stack. So, the 2 firms that I’m most aware of, which make {hardware} that I’ve used myself, are BrainsWay, that’s one firm after which one other one is MagVenture. The {hardware} are completely different. I do know individuals who have responded very properly to each of them, so you possibly can vet sure suppliers. I’d say not saying that is the one means, I’m not saying it’s honest maybe there are different applied sciences on the market, however as you’ll count on, there’s a good bolus of fly-by-night operations which can be promising miracles and providing “TMS” that’s truly not following any protocol in anyway. I feel that’s very unethical, however BrainsWay, MagVenture are two kinds of {hardware} and then you definately actually wish to look, it’s obtainable is the quick reply. Accelerated TMS is accessible in a variety of main cities. It isn’t as extensively distributed as I would really like as a result of it’s usually not coated by insurance coverage.
Accelerated TMS is mostly not coated. TMS, let’s simply name it standard TMS is commonly coated by insurance coverage relying on the indication, however accelerated TMS the place you’re mainly taking per week off work and simply getting your brains up 10 hours a day for 5 days straight, usually not coated. And a part of why I’m so excited in regards to the implications if the information scale and are strong and present comparable or superior outcomes with this pre-administration of this drug is that the power of anybody, whether or not they’re common, much less financially steady or very well-heeled of taking at some point off of labor, isn’t solely logistically a lot simpler in the event that they’re capable of pre-administer with this DCS, however it ought to be a lot inexpensive.
So, I’m hoping even when individuals should pay out of pocket that these breakthroughs, hopefully they’re breakthroughs with mixture therapies of TMS, accelerated TMS and D-cycloserine will actually make it far more extensively obtainable. That’s my hope. It’s going to take a short while, however it’s obtainable. I do know there are clinics in, as an example, New York, I do know there are clinics in California and Chicago which can be credible. They could exist in different places as properly.
Dan Harris: The opposite factor you talked about when it comes to having a unique life is your deal with relationships, and I noticed myself in that reply. There was a type of desertification or desertification, I don’t know the way you pronounce it, of my social life for a few years as a result of I used to be such a careerist and such a workaholic, after which in recent times have actually turned that round and I see such a large distinction in my psychological well being. I’m curious, you talked about that in recent times you’ve on the prime of yearly you make a plan to see the individuals who, to make use of the cliche fill your cup. Had you gone by a interval like I did the place there was a specific amount of isolation or inattention to this lever?
Tim Ferriss: Oh, for positive. There have been a number of completely different causes for that. I don’t know if hindsight’s 20/20, however I feel it’s simpler to see from my vantage level now, and it’s a balancing act as a result of there’s compulsive socializing since you are extremely uncomfortable or afraid of being alone or with your self.
Dan Harris: Sure.
Tim Ferriss: Proper. There’s compulsive socializing to distract your self, like defend your self from your self, which is problematic. After which there’s compulsive isolation and I’d say I in all probability leaned much more in direction of the compulsive isolation and there have been two causes for that. One was workaholism again within the day for positive, and I simply felt like I used to be simpler, capable of produce, extra capable of deal with enterprise, funds, no matter it could be in isolation and there could be some fact to that. Then I’d say there was additionally this perception that I feel on the time was actually implicit. I don’t assume I explicitly grasped it, which was I’ve written this extremely lengthy essay that perhaps I’ll publish in some unspecified time in the future, however speaking about among the risks of self-help and one in every of them is the next, which ties into what we’re speaking about and leaning in direction of isolation.
This implicit perception or express that you want to work on your self and repair your self and “do the work” and then you definately’ll be able to work together with different individuals and have a big relationship and interact with your loved ones if that’s an possibility otherwise you need it to be an possibility, et cetera, et cetera. So, in impact, the analogy that I’ve drawn for some associates is you wish to play soccer, however first you’re going to learn all of the textbooks and get a grasp’s diploma and PhD in soccer and then you definately’re in a apply dribbling and penalty pictures and so forth by your self and also you wish to change into as excellent a participant as attainable by your self earlier than you ever truly get on the sector and play the sport of soccer and you can begin to imagine that you just’re taking part in soccer by your self. There’s at all times extra room for enchancment. You’re by no means going to be excellent.
And for those who get caught in that lure, which is the partial lure of self-help, you’re at all times sprucing this self and it might change into this actual recursive harmful lure, this fixation on the self, and also you by no means truly fucking play soccer. And at a degree you begin to imagine that you’re, however you’re not. You’re simulating by your self life, however not truly participating with life. And I’ve, who is aware of, perhaps this can be a perform of getting older. I don’t assume so essentially, however for thus many many years I used to be within the chopping fringe of all the pieces, and I nonetheless am, however I’ve change into equally in issues which have lasted millennia or greater than millennia.
And I like to recommend, for those who’re attempting to learn the way the newest LLMs differ from each other, et cetera, you additionally spend a while taking a look at evolutionary biology and learning the issues that we have now advanced to optimize for to expertise. And man, it’s identical to, I feel it was Reaganomics, proper? “It’s the financial system, silly.” It’s the connection, silly, proper? Should you don’t have bodily contact with individuals, in case you have these in actual life bodily experiences, for those who mannequin that in animals, they change into an entire catastrophe. They exhibit the identical kinds of behaviors that we now see spiking in people—nervousness, melancholy, lethargy, sitting in a cage, not doing something. We want the sort of contact. So I’d say that I’ve offset the bleeding edge with the very, very tremendous boring fringe of issues which have lasted a very long time.
Dan Harris: Amen.
Arising, Tim talks in regards to the perils of self-op optimization and the key to what we truly ought to be optimizing for, the ketogenic food plan, utilizing AI as a way of working in your well being. In different phrases, must you be speaking to talk field about your medical stuff and far more.
The query I’m about to ask may convey us again to your unpublished essay in regards to the risks of self-help, however you talked about the phrase optimizing and in some methods I type of consider you because the proto-optimizer, 4-Hour Workweek.
Tim Ferriss: Certain.
Dan Harris: I’m simply curious the place you might be on self-optimization now?
Tim Ferriss: I’d say that I nonetheless deal with sure areas to optimize. I nonetheless pull sure levers and what I’d say I’ve change into a lot better at, and it takes apply, it’s going to sound so rudimentary, is asking merely what are you optimizing for earlier than you optimize? Why are you optimizing? And it’s simple, I’d say notably in case you are being formed by social media, which appears to mainly give you the seven deadlier cardinal sins on a silver platter, you get to select your poison. Should you’re being formed by that, then you possibly can find yourself optimizing and not using a path essentially or questioned. You haven’t interrogated the path. And that may very well be since you’re following somebody on-line who’s a multi-billion greenback actual property developer/serial entrepreneur/fill within the clean and the chase for cash is on. However that by no means actually will get interrogated. I feel The 4-Hour Workweek does a superb job of breaking down type of work for work’s sake and cash for cash’s sake.
So, for me, I’ve three kin proper now with quickly progressing Alzheimer’s illness, together with those that shouldn’t have the genotype. If we have a look at say, APOE standing, proper? They’re APOE 3/3, whereas I’m APOE 3/4. So, that’s scary. There are different elements to think about for Alzheimer’s. I’m doing issues to strive to not die from one thing that’s hopefully preventable from the attitude of cardiac well being, cardiovascular well being, after which additionally attempting to mitigate my threat of neurodegenerative illness. And that’s why I’m in ketosis proper now, as an example, and juries out on a few of this, however very plausibly, there are mechanisms by which going into ketosis on a reasonably common foundation for a number of weeks at a time, let’s simply say in my case two or 3 times a yr might have neuroprotective results, additionally anti-cancer results.
And other people can take heed to my interviews with Dominic D’Agostino, he’s a researcher out of Florida or different individuals for the science behind this. And it’s additionally an intervention, and this comes again to your query about optimizing that may be very, very properly studied within the sense that I’ve very excessive confidence that the draw back threat is low and really manageable, whereas for those who’re simply mainlining GLP-1 agonists, wonderful outcomes that we’ve seen within the literature to this point. However have we had anybody on these for 10, 20 years? No, at the least not 20 years. Perhaps among the first monkeys shot within the area like me with the accelerated TMS and the DCS has been on for that time frame. That doesn’t imply don’t use GLP-1 agonists, however perceive that there are a variety of unknown unknowns.
With the ketogenic food plan, it’s like look, the ketogenic food plan in its fashionable incarnation utilizing heavy cream or different kinds of fat, what’s designed for epileptic youngsters, and this goes again in all probability 100 years at this level, if not 100 years near it, and people have the metabolic equipment to enter ketosis and have had that equipment for millennia upon a millennia upon millennia. That might be an instance of one thing that passes the check for me of seemingly credible upside potential, even when we don’t perceive all of the mechanisms, restricted draw back potential that I can offset with sure pharmaceuticals, let’s simply say as a result of I’m a ldl cholesterol hyper-absorber. And okay, nice, we’re going to do this.
Intermittent fasting can be one other one. Throughout ketosis or exterior of ketosis, the one factor that has most dramatically modified my blood exams with respect to particularly insulin sensitivity and avoiding prediabetes, which runs rampant in my household, intermittent fasting. In my case, which means I’m consuming inside an eight-hour window every day. It could be even a bit shorter, like 2:00 p.m. to eight:00 p.m. and that’s it. I simply don’t eat till 2:00 p.m. or 3:00 p.m. And for some people, it’s arguably higher for you for those who do like a 12:00 midday to eight:00 p.m. type of consuming window. It’s additionally referred to as time-restricted feeding. There’s a variety of good science for this, not simply in animal fashions, however in people. And the outcomes I’ve seen from which can be simply completely unbelievable and it’s so easy since you don’t really want to alter what you eat, you’re simply altering once you eat.
So, these can be two that folks may consider as optimizing. After which I’m taking a handful of pharmaceuticals to offset the cardiovascular threat as a result of it doesn’t matter if I’m consuming an all-fat food plan, an all-protein food plan, a vegan food plan, a fill-in-the-blank food plan, there are particular biomarkers which can be simply trash, they’re so dangerous. And that appears to be simply straight from the code, straight from DNA. And for that purpose, I’m like, “Ah, no spring hen anymore. You already know what? I feel I’ll simply chew the bullet and take a few of these.”
And when, as an example, I discuss with my docs now, the very first thing is in case you have a blood check and one thing is out of vary, my suggestion can be earlier than you get on 12 completely different medicine to take care of it, and if it’s an emergency, it’s an emergency, but when it’s not an emergency, like your triglycerides are excessive, all proper, properly, it’s in all probability not going to kill you within the subsequent week.
My suggestion can be discuss to your physician, replicate the check, do the check once more the subsequent week, perhaps on a unique day and see for those who can replicate the error. As a result of as an example, for those who had a heavy weekend of consuming or a fatty meal the evening earlier than and then you definately do your blood check at a.m. the subsequent morning fasted, properly, you may appear to be you’re on the street having coronary heart assault in two months, however truly it was simply conduct and food plan. So, replicate, replicate, that will be primary. Don’t base the end result of the basketball match on one {photograph}. Attempt to get examined extra continuously and take note of once you’re getting examined. So, for those who’re, as an example, coming again to the instance I gave, for those who’re taking your check, your blood check on Monday mornings, make sure that your subsequent check that you just’re evaluating it to can be on Monday morning.
If it’s Wednesday morning, it could be fully completely different. By the way in which, if it’s one thing like cortisol, testosterone, et cetera, this stuff have diurnal cycles. They actually fluctuate all through the day. So, for those who get a check at 8:00 a.m., I’ve seen this with associates of mine, male associates who get a check at like 8:00 a.m. and I’ve to interrogate how they did issues for them to Sherlock Holmes this, however they’re involved about their testosterone ranges or the free testosterone, they take a check at 8:00 a.m., seems to be nice. They do one other check three months later, six months later, they do it at 11:00 a.m. and it’s 200 factors decrease. Appears to be like loopy. And it’s not loopy. They don’t truly — on this case, this man had no drawback. He was about to get on all types of hormone alternative remedy and all these things that’s fairly highly effective.
And I mentioned, “Return, do it at 8:00 a.m. once more, two weeks. Let’s see what occurs.” Guess what? It was the identical as the primary check. So, that’s step primary. After which once I’m taking a look at attainable interventions for me, once more, I’m not a health care provider, don’t play one on the web, however the way in which I strategy it, and other people get little or no steerage on this, most docs are overstretched, proper? They get 11 minutes per affected person. The simplest factor for them to do is say, “Look, this man has an issue or this lady has an issue. If we throw these three medicine at it, it’s in all probability going to repair it. My job, so far as I’m involved, so far as my time permits is to maintain this individual from dying. Okay. Begin these three medicine.” However what I’ve tried to do, and I did this with my very own explicit cardiac state of affairs, and I feel Boston Well being is the testing that I did to get a extra granular understanding of issues with a bit increased decision.
However since I’m a ldl cholesterol hyper-absorber, that informs the kind of drug I would take doesn’t essentially should be one thing like a statin. And there have been three or 4 medicine that I used to be steered to take and I mentioned, “What’s the longest examine of those with the most effective facet impact profile that’s the most innocuous that I can begin with? And we are able to do one other check in two months. This isn’t an emergency. I’m not about to have a pulmonary embolism or coronary heart assault, don’t have any arteries blocked. What’s it?” And it was in my case, not everyone, one thing referred to as ezetimibe, in any other case referred to as Zetia, very properly studied, very properly tolerated. I mentioned, “Let me do this in case I’m a hyper responder,” as a result of generally you could be a hyper responder or a non responder, however I used to be like, “Let me simply strive it out.”
And statistically most unlikely that I’d be, the physician mentioned. Nonetheless, tried it. Two months later, retest, guess what? I’m a hyper responder. So, I used to be ready to make use of the minimal efficient dose for medicine and finally added yet one more factor, however what number of many years of attainable unintended effects did I simply spare myself by doing mainly like one and a half medicine as a substitute of beginning with 4 or 5 and doing that indefinitely from that time ahead?
Dan Harris: If you’re coping with your docs, to what extent do you seek the advice of AI? I’ve discovered personally that speaking to a chatbot has been extremely useful. Now, with the caveat that they hallucinate and so they fuck issues up on a regular basis, and so I’m not taking it as gospel as a result of your chatbot doesn’t become bored with you and doesn’t have an 11-minute window to speak to you. So, you possibly can actually spend a variety of time, after which what I discovered is that I can then run what I’ve discovered by my docs. Is that an expertise you’ve had?
Tim Ferriss: For positive, and I do use AI and these LLMs rather a lot. What I’d say is that for those who’re going to do one thing like that, my suggestion can be, and I’ll give a shameless plug simply because I’m concerned with this firm, I feel they’re doing nice issues, however you can use one thing like a ChatGPT, however there’s some instruments which can be designed for studying. There’s one referred to as Oboe, O-B-O-E.com. Get some fundamental literacy, simply the ABC’s of fundamental medical terminology that will be useful for understanding issues like blood exams. It’s like 100 phrases, perhaps 200 phrases maybe on the very, very tippity prime if you wish to be an overachiever, develop an understanding of the essential vocabulary so as to additionally talk about this stuff in shorthand together with your docs. So, when you develop fundamental medical literacy, you can additionally use that to discover ways to learn research, discover ways to learn a scientific summary and examine. That might be among the best investments you can ever make together with your time.
Spend a day doing that or two afternoons, holy shit, the ROI, and that’s unbelievable. The variety of medical issues averted, the variety of medical procedures averted. The variety of non-obvious options discovered that my fundamental literacy has helped to unravel for is unbelievable. It doesn’t take very lengthy. So, I’d use the instruments to type of do this first. So, that’ll make it easier to with prompts. The solutions are solely going to be pretty much as good as your prompts. When you’ve executed that, then I exploit AI on a regular basis and there’s an expression which has been useful for me. I can run fairly sizzling. I feel that’s chilled out rather a lot, however I can run fairly sizzling. I’m usually very impatient. I’ve been since I used to be a toddler, and the expression is don’t attribute to malice what you possibly can attribute to incompetence, however it goes additional than that.
Simply because any individual doesn’t reply to you, it doesn’t imply it’s a private entrance. Simply because somebody does one thing silly and so they reply one in every of your questions out of the three, you emailed them, you will be like, “Ah.” You may get actually wound up. However I’d go additional than that, which is don’t attribute to malice or incompetence, what will be defined by a busy schedule. Individuals are busy. All people’s busy. However what you are able to do is you possibly can, after creating this fundamental literacy, you possibly can go in after which you possibly can ask questions that your docs might not have time for. I’m at all times checking for contraindications between drugs and in addition dietary supplements as a result of docs will miss these. They may miss them. They won’t miss the obvious, however there are some that aren’t as apparent.
For example, there are sleep drugs like trazodone, which actually have an effect on the serotonergic system. It’s successfully — that is an overstatement, however it’s successfully a failed antidepressant. So, for those who don’t know that, and it’s not technically precisely an SSRI, like a Prozac, however there are some similarities, for those who don’t know that since you’re taking a sleep medicine and then you definately exit and take one thing that’s contraindicated for this whole class of serotonin particular antidepressants, you may get your self into hassle.
So, I’ll usually examine for contraindications. That’s one factor I do. I’ve associates who’ve uploaded their entire genome to a few of these LLMs and ask for insights, and so they’ve recognized some outstanding issues. The danger in doing all of that is that you could be uncover points that in case you are susceptible to nervousness, for lots of causes, I’m type of inoculated towards this with medical stuff as a result of I’ve spent a lot time within the medical and scientific world.
However — provide you with an instance, one other factor that I do yearly or twice a yr is a full physique MRI, and there are firms that do that. I feel Biograph is the very best degree. Prenuvo can be fairly good, however I’ve seen a few individuals have cancers missed, which isn’t nice. So, for those who get a full physique MRI and you might be over the age of 40, you’re going to search out one thing, you’re in all probability going to search out some sort of inner cysts.
You may discover for those who had as a good friend of mine did like a small mind aneurysm, you’re in all probability going to search out one thing. And the query is, are you able to deal with that? Are you able to deal with both doing one thing about it, which is presumably why you’re doing it within the first place, or are you able to take care of the overwhelming probability statistically that the physician’s going to say, “Yeah, we discovered X, Y, or Z, you don’t have to do something about it? We’ll simply regulate it.” Are you going to have the ability to deal with that with out changing into a stress case who’s combing by LLMs and WebMD all day making your self loopy? Anyway, I’ll cease there. However sure, I exploit these instruments on a regular basis. Should you’re going to make use of one software, use one other software to reality examine it. So, for those who get one thing from chat GPT, completely have that factor cross examined by Claude or one other software. Don’t belief these instruments with their first solutions.
Dan Harris: Simply on the pan-scan factor, the total physique MRI, the last word, this can be a little bit of an apart, however I’ve discovered the last word well being hack, which is marry a health care provider as a result of she will’t get out of right here, and I ask her a variety of questions, however she is actually towards these pan-scans for the very purpose that you just simply acknowledged, which is you will discover one thing and it could stress you out, or it could put you out there for a process you don’t want. Yeah, so it’s fascinating that there’re completely different POVs on this.
Tim Ferriss: One in all my favourite quotes is “Be suspicious of what you need.” That’s a Rumi quote, going means again. It’s like we expect that we wish all the well being data we are able to presumably get, however you need to be a bit skeptical and suspicious of that for those who’ve by no means handled an enormous quantity of well being data at excessive decision. So, yeah, it’s very private factor. In my case, psychologically, this explicit sort of knowledge overwhelm, I’m fairly good with.
Dan Harris: So I requested earlier than about the place you might be with optimizing now and also you mentioned you’re extra surgical now in the way you optimizing. You listed a bunch of areas together with the way you eat. You probably did put out a podcast in August of 2025 speaking about a few of your rethinking of optimizing. I’d simply be curious, the place are you at with that now?
Tim Ferriss: I feel that optimizing is the how, broadly talking, the way you do one thing. Far more essential than the way you do one thing is the few some issues that you just select within the first place to do. This is applicable to studying shortly. This is applicable to creating some huge cash. This is applicable to getting in nice form. What you do in a way issues much more than the way you do something. You may get very, very, excellent, very optimized, very environment friendly at doing one thing unimportant that doesn’t make it essential, simply makes you excellent at doing one thing that you just in all probability shouldn’t be doing within the first place. Trendy productiveness porn is indiscriminate in the way it applies, optimizing to all the pieces and all the pieces.
There’s some very humorous morning routines which can be these YouTube movies which can be 4 or 5 hours lengthy of individuals going by their day. There’s a degree at which your morning routine simply turns right into a five-hour warm-up for all times every day.
That’s clearly a very excessive instance, however for me, for those who had been to have a nanny cam hidden in a bit stuffed bear in my home, my workplace, this Airbnb the place I’m proper now, and also you watched me on any given day, you’d simply be like, “What is that this man doing?” I imply, it’s like a poorly programmed Roomba. Is that this Blair Witch Challenge? It doesn’t appear to be doing a lot work. What’s he doing? And a part of the explanation I can get away with that’s that I feel I’m excellent at measuring twice and chopping as soon as. On this context, what which means is I’m spending a variety of time taking a look at doing 80/20 evaluation, asking myself, what can I do that isn’t simply replicated by another person that I discover simpler to do than different individuals? Which is type of a shortcut to discovering issues that you just’re good at that you just’ll even have the endurance for as a result of it’s simpler for you otherwise you’re obsessive about it.
Okay, what am I obsessive about? What am I doing in my off hours? Okay, let me attempt to discover a Venn diagram of that after which deal with these issues. I’ll check it for a really quick time frame to see if primary, I can maintain it. If I’m truly pretty much as good as I assumed I’d be, I must be the most effective on the earth, however higher than common. Then over time, as I’m throwing rather a lot towards the wall after which I’m trying again and saying, “Okay, I attempted these three issues, or I made these 4 investments. I had these assumptions on the time. Did they pan out? Why or why not?” After which course-correcting. They’re truly very, very, very, only a few issues you need to get proper, for my part, to have an unbelievable life. You don’t must be nice at a variety of issues is my perspective.
It’s like, look, I keep in mind speaking to Jerry Seinfeld and one in every of his conclusions was for those who carry weights and do Transcendental Meditation, that’ll clear up just about all of your issues. And I’m paraphrasing, however it wasn’t too removed from that. He’s like, “Should you carry weights and do TM, it’ll clear up most of your issues.” I like that as a result of I feel there’s an entire hell of a variety of fact to it that distilling down and it makes life appear far more manageable. If individuals really feel like they should win this tremendous extremely decathlon of life the place as a substitute of 10 sports activities, there are 150 sports activities you need to be good at, who’s going to truly surmount that and address it properly? No person. So, for me, it’s like, look, if I needed to simply pull a rabbit out of a hat proper now to select a number of, I’d be like, “Learn Nonviolent Communication.”
Work out discuss to individuals with out sounding overly defensive or aggressive. Life, until we’re going to be a monk of some sort or a nun, and even then in all probability, there’s some loopy inner politics on the Hamlet in China, if you already know the abbot, you’re going to should take care of that abbot. So, work in your communication. Take that very critically because the connective tissue for all the pieces. Don’t put money into stuff you don’t perceive. It’s like when unsure, learn a number of books on low-cost index funds and the S&P 500. Go have a look at the graph over the past 5, 10, 15, 20 years.
You might need some laborious dips right here and there, however for those who’re attempting to get fancy and put money into particular person AI shares, like wow, perhaps you’ll choose Amazon and Google out of all of the trash there’s proper now. However most of us, I don’t assume I can do it. Raise weights, attempt to do some zone two coaching the place it’s like you can communicate in single sentences, however you don’t actually wish to do this for 30 to 60 minutes a number of instances per week after which don’t eat processed crap, Michael Pollan guidelines. In case your grandmother wouldn’t acknowledge the substances, don’t eat it. Attempt that. I feel you’ll do fairly properly.
Dan Harris: Arduous to argue with any of that. Arising, Tim talks about why you want to say no extra typically and the instruments you want with the intention to get higher at saying no, doing a digital detox, defanging your careers and a brand new recreation he designed.
One in all your present tasks is named The No E book, and the e-book, as Tim has identified, might come out in 10 years as a result of he’s engaged on it slowly. However he has launched a few chapters on-line and I’ve learn at the least one in every of them and it’s actually fascinating. So, earlier than I say an excessive amount of, perhaps you can describe what’s The No E book and why are you writing it if solely slowly?
Tim Ferriss: Yeah, I’ve an 800-page draft proper now, so it’s going to wish to get whittled down a bit bit. However The No E book began one thing like, boy, six years in the past the place I observed lots of people in my viewers, my listeners, my readers scuffling with focus and saying no, as a result of essentially the street to the place you wish to be in life is Wizard of Oz, golden brick street is saying sure to some issues, a number of issues. There are only a few issues you need to get proper. That’s the sure street and it’s only a few issues. The guardrails for which can be no. It’s important to say no all the means. I used to be scripting this e-book, I reached out to a bunch of my associates, these are very completed associates, on this case, to ask them for his or her suggestions. I assumed they’d assist me write this factor and so they had been like, “Oh, my God, are you kidding me? That is the most important ache in my life. Please ship me an early copy when you possibly can.”
So, my associates, there have been a number of who had been truly very useful, however the overwhelming majority had been like, “Oh, my God, I assumed that life was going to get simpler. It has solely gotten more durable with respect to saying no.” It simply turned this large venture. So, I put it on the again burner after which a good friend of mine, Neil Strauss, some individuals may acknowledge that identify, he’s written one thing like 10 New York Occasions bestsellers and he’s horrible at saying no, it seems. And he was busting my balls about not scripting this e-book, and he saved harassing me about ending it, and he was truly type of making a kerfuffle over a gaggle dinner after a number of drinks. And I used to be identical to, “Neil, if you wish to learn this e-book so badly, why don’t you simply assist me end writing it?”
And I assumed that put it to mattress, after which the subsequent day once we all sobered up, he was like, “Should you’re critical, why don’t we speak about it?” On the similar time, I used to be noticing with social media, actually with AI, it’s going to get a thousand instances worse. To start with, the exterior forces that wish to distract you might be virtually unbeatable. It’s unbelievable how refined they’re. Secondly, the way in which that permits self interruption and distraction is one thing that humanity has by no means seen earlier than. There may be this unbelievable ache when it comes to paradox of selection. What ought to I do? Who ought to I take heed to? What ought to I watch? What ought to I take note of? That’s fracturing the psyches of individuals. And this, by the way in which, geographically, doesn’t discriminate. Economically, it’s like up and down the chain, left, proper, entrance, middle, in all places.
The issues simply appear to be getting greater and greater and greater. So, wrote this e-book with Neil mainly as the scholar and what’s enjoyable about it, I feel it’s my most entertaining and hilarious e-book in a means, as a result of I’m giving Neil these assignments after which he’ll strive them, however it’ll be passive-aggressive and he’ll screw one up or he’ll truly not do 50% of the project after which I’ll observe up and he’ll have all this guilt. However we have now actual examples of emails he tried to ship, textual content messages he’s attempting to ship. He’s attempting all the pieces within the e-book and studying as he goes. And I’d say there are a number of individuals who have proofread the entire thing and so they’d proofread it like a yr in the past. They’ve come again — and these are followers of my stuff who’ve learn my different books and so they’re like, “This e-book has had a huge effect on my life,” and so they nonetheless give me examples.
So to then reply the query of, properly, what precisely is the e-book speaking about? The e-book is speaking about say no in a world of compulsive sure, however what’s essential to notice about that is it’s not sufficient to simply have a few index playing cards or templates for doing train for saying no. If that will’ve labored, it will’ve labored already. Certain, I can provide examples and I give tons of examples of traces which can be useful for saying no. Like Martha Beck, who was Oprah Winfrey’s life coach and was a tremendous girl in her personal proper for lots of causes. She turned me down for one thing and I embrace these actual nos as a result of I saved my favourite declines and rejections over 10 years. And so, I share a bunch of them and she or he mentioned to me, “I actually want I may, however I can’t do the life Tetris.” Do the life Tetris.
And I used to be like, “Wow, that’s so good. You’re not explaining, you’re not defending, you’re not giving a bunch of stuff that somebody can attempt to negotiate round.” It’s identical to, “Hey, I actually want I may. I simply can’t do the life Tetris.” And so, I give examples like that, however that isn’t sufficient. When you begin actually digging into why individuals have hassle saying no, it’s not solely as a result of they lack templates, it’s due to sure core beliefs, that are ideas we take to be true, to cite Byron Katie and philosophies they’ve that they’re not even conscious of that make it virtually not possible to say no. And that might relate to FOMO. It may very well be associated to a really shortage minded, restricted variety of alternatives, a perception that you may’t generate alternatives your self. It’s important to await issues to come back as inbound.
And I hit these very early on, and truly I feel they’re within the pattern chapters that folks can get if individuals go to tim.weblog/nobook. So, tim.weblog is the precise URL/nobook, one phrase. I feel it’s 30 or 40 pages of the e-book that may get into this, however a variety of people will say, “I’m too good for that.” Okay, we unpack that as a result of there’s rather a lot there, proper? Should be good for Tim or fill within the clean as a result of they’re already profitable. I don’t have that luxurious. Proper. Okay, properly, let’s truly double-click on that and begin to interrogate a few of these beliefs and on and on and on. So, saying no in a sturdy means, actually creating a toolkit, which so far as I’m involved is a self-preservation necessity now. After I first began it six years in the past, I used to be like, “If individuals actually wish to get 10X ends in their life and proceed to use the issues from The 4-Hour Workweek, like 80/20, et cetera, they actually need to have a dependable toolkit for saying no.”
However now, taking a look at social media AI, social media enabled AI, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, what it’s going to do to inboxes, messaging, et cetera, like personalization spam, you fill within the clean which can be indistinguishable from people, that is figuring out breathe so far as I’m involved. It’s important to have a toolkit like this. You’re going to be a roadkill, I feel. That sounds in all probability very dramatic, however it’s like I’m sitting at Silicon Valley proper now for my first journey right here for a number of weeks in length in like eight years, I’m telling you guys the stuff that’s coming goes to be wonderful. It’s going to be unbelievable. It’s additionally simply going to be catastrophic for lots of minds which can be unprepared with the right toolkits. So, saying no is essential.
Dan Harris: Agreed. And it’s an enormous battle for me. You will have a gorgeous phrase in your e-book, promiscuous over dedication, and I’m actually, actually responsible of that. There’s one other good phrase you say, “The e-book will make it easier to construct a benevolent phalanx, protecting wall of troops to protect your objectives.” We don’t have time to speak about all the instruments in there, however is there a software specifically you assume that will be very, very highly effective for individuals?
Tim Ferriss: Sure, completely. A variety of people have maybe heard the apocryphal story of — and I feel I give correct credit score within the e-book, and this is among the chapters that folks can get. So, there’s loads of worth that folks get from the free stuff, however, I imply I’m not even promoting it but, so perhaps I’ll give away extra. One of many culprits, one of many greatest causal elements for why individuals have hassle saying no is that they don’t have sufficiently big yeses to defend.
And as an example, for those who had a model new baby, or somebody you really liked, God forbid, had a critical most cancers analysis, for those who had a tiger by the tail and knew that you just had been engaged on a enterprise, I’m utilizing an excessive instance on function, they may very well be value billions of {dollars}. You wouldn’t have hassle saying no to issues. So, then we return to the opposite finish of the spectrum, it’s like, properly, for those who don’t have actually clearly outlined huge yeses that get you excited, which have the potential for big payoff, not essentially financially, and you might be type of looking out round your inbox for issues to reply when individuals ship you an invitation to a dinner or they wish to have espresso to select your mind, or it may very well be something, a fancy dress get together you don’t wish to go to, that’s an actual instance from Neil truly, and also you’re going to say sure as a result of what’s scarier than having a lot of little or promiscuous over dedication, it’s an enormous void.
So, the apocryphal story that I used to be hinting at is the story of the professor who is available in, and I wish to say this was from initially Stephen Covey or perhaps Stephen Covey tailored it. The 7 Habits of Extremely Profitable Folks, I imagine was the e-book. It’d’ve been in his educating and never within the books themselves, however the story is alongside these traces. The professor goes in and he places out on the desk in entrance of the scholars like a big mason jar, a handful of massive rocks, three or 4, a bunch of gravel, after which a bunch of sand. And he challenges the scholars, asks them first how they’d match as a lot as attainable into the mason jar, and so they strive completely different approaches. So, for those who put within the sand first, then you definately get a bit little bit of gravel in, can’t match the rocks. Nicely, ditto for those who put the gravel in first, then you definately put within the sand, perhaps you match one rock, and finally the lesson is you need to put within the huge rocks first, then the gravel matches round that, after which you possibly can match within the sand.
Within the model that I inform, I make a modification to that and I say, “It doesn’t matter what they do, there’s nonetheless sand left over on the desk.” And I feel the lesson is for those who’re taking a look at this when it comes to commitments, the massive rocks are these type of life-changing yeses, the few issues you want to defend on that golden street to get actually the place you wish to be. Then the gravel, to me are the smaller, however vital issues you want to do. Bought to file your taxes, obtained to do A, B, or C. After which the sand is all that extraneous stuff, largely distractions. You possibly can match a few of it, however for those who schedule all that stuff first, it’s going to crowd out the gravel or it’s actually on the very least going to crowd out all the massive yeses.
So within the pattern chapters, I simply stroll individuals by how I do that previous yr overview and the way I truly choose the massive yeses as a result of the e-book on no is equally a e-book on — to reply the query, how the hell in a world of infinite choices, in a world of temptation round each nook do you choose a number of issues to deal with which can be actually excessive leverage? How do you do it? That looks like a easy query, however it’s truly a really laborious query to reply. So, I’d say that for those who’re having hassle saying no, beneath that in all probability is the truth that you don’t have a sufficiently big yeses which can be value defending. After which there’s rather a lot that leads from that. How do you decide to a sure and insure towards reneging or one thing else? That is supposed to be, hopefully all of my books, a really sensible e-book.
So what occurs once you screw up? There’s a complete chapter on renegotiate commitments after you may have already overcommitted. As a result of guess what? When you’ve got that tendency, you’re going to overcommit. You’re going to take a look at your calendar for the subsequent few weeks or month and say, “Good Lord, I’m screwed.” After which what do you do? You’re going to should have some very probably uncomfortable conversations. So, we’re studying to renegotiate commitments can be an artwork kind that’s going to be included in it, however essentially it’s huge sure is value defending, I’d say is one other one.
And positive, there are many issues that you are able to do that you can do in the present day. You don’t have to take a look at any of those chapters. I’ve not had social media on my telephone in three years. Why? As a result of I really feel like you might be bringing a butter knife to a gunfight in case you have these instruments in your telephone. And if it’s too scary to unplug for 3 years, you don’t should decide to that. I didn’t at first. It’s like do a one or two week social media quick, at the least in your telephone. So, I can nonetheless entry social media if I would like successful of the heroin, I can nonetheless entry social media by my laptop computer, however it provides sufficient friction that I’m not going to finish up taking a look at Instagram whereas I’m on the bathroom and questioning why I can’t really feel my legs 40 minutes later. It’s going to keep away from that sort of factor. Or the compulsive type of dopamine scratching. Each time you may have free 30 seconds, leaping into social media, this isn’t good in your capability to focus. It’s not good in your capability to single process.
It’s not good in your psychological well being once you at all times have that escape. I imply, look, I’m telling individuals issues they in all probability agree with, however maybe haven’t applied. So, you can do one thing like that. You should use an app like Freedom. There’s an app referred to as Freedom that you need to use to dam sure issues for sure durations of time. I imply, there are these technical instruments that you need to use, however on the very base, you possibly can’t use extra window dressing technical methods to repair basic issues with aim choice. Huge sure is value defending. And core beliefs, if I say no to this individual or one thing dangerous goes to occur and so they’re not going to love me, they’ll cease inviting me to issues.
When you’ve got these and that’s going to what? It’s important to ask, after which what? After which what? I’m going to finish up alone? Okay, properly, these are type of Rubicons you want to get snug crossing within the sense that my expertise is, that is additionally Neil’s expertise, he had tons of fears as did I at first levels. It’s like once you begin to arise for the issues which can be essential in your life, I feel this can be a Dr. Seuss quote, however it’s like “The individuals who thoughts don’t matter and the individuals who matter don’t thoughts.” You truly do a variety of pruning in your life that it’s best to do anyway. And it’s a forcing perform for that.
Dan Harris: It’s so fascinating. It truly is about braveness in the long run.
Tim Ferriss: It’s. And you’ll prepare that. You possibly can prepare that. It’s not one thing you might be born with or with out. That’s one thing by truly understanding what your fears symbolize and what’s beneath them. It may very well be from childhood, it doesn’t essentially should be, however once you begin to truly study them — there’s an train individuals may do in the present day additionally. They will discover a TED Speak on this referred to as fear-setting.
You begin to do fear-setting round these fears, you defang them, and guess what? Out of the blue you may have this factor that others may name braveness, however what it’s, it’s readability. It’s readability across the precise draw back, which is proscribed versus the upside of defending these huge yeses over a yr, two or three. And I’ll say to not proceed to beat this lifeless horse, however with all the noise that’s right here, however that’s coming with AI, it’s going to be 10, 100, 1,000 instances worse inside two years. Should you can single process on essential issues for not even 4 hours a day, two hours a day with out interruption, you will be from the attitude of let’s simply say an consideration financial system within the prime one p.c of performers. It’s by no means been simpler and it’s by no means been more durable in a means.
Dan Harris: I’m going to lose you in 9 minutes, so I do wish to make sure that I shortly ask you about Coyote, one other of your tasks. It is a recreation that you just’ve designed. What’s it and why?
Tim Ferriss: Yeah. So, Coyote, it’s a tiny little card recreation that I designed with a few of my associates at Exploding Kittens, which individuals may acknowledge. They’ve a variety of very, very talked-about video games and it’s a enjoyable household recreation. It’s one thing like, for those who may think about charades meets sizzling potato meets brain-teaser, one thing that I hope in some unspecified time in the future I’d truly love to do a scientific examine on this, however it makes you just a bit bit smarter than the individuals who play. It’s a informal card recreation. You possibly can be taught a couple of minutes. Every recreation lasts about 10 minutes. And the explanation I created it, I at all times wished to make a recreation, primary, and that is truly a superb illustration of among the stuff that’s within the e-book that’ll come out in 100 years, however individuals can apply it in the present day, which is I select tasks based mostly on which tasks will permit me to win even when they fail.
What does that imply? I assume that any venture may fail for causes completely exterior of my management. It’s occurred earlier than, it’ll occur once more, occurs to individuals every single day. So, how am I then selecting issues to decide to? Nicely, usually I’m doing all these two-week experiments on numerous issues just like the food plan and this, that and the opposite factor. With tasks, it’s like a six-month dedication. I’m taking a look at a six to 12 month venture the place I actually go all in. By the way in which, that makes it simpler to say no to issues once you’re doing a dash versus a really gradual strolling marathon. So, I’m committing to one thing that I feel might be six to 12 months and I’m optimizing for what I’ll be taught, the density of studying and in addition the relationships that I’ll deepen or develop.
So, it may very well be with new individuals, may very well be with individuals I already know, with the assumption that these relationships and people expertise or information will transcend that venture even when the general public hates it, even when in my case, as an example, China tariffs for a recreation that’s offered for $9 or $10 coming from China, that simply kills the economics. Not that this was ever a moneymaking factor for me, however it’s like there are issues that got here up that made this abruptly a lot more durable from a enterprise perspective. And thank God I checked these different packing containers as a result of happily it’s obtained 9.7 or 9.8 stars on Amazon and it’s obtainable in all places. It’s doing rather well. However what I actually care about is like Elan Lee, who’s the co-founder and CEO of Exploding Kittens has change into an excellent shut good friend. He was a superb good friend beforehand, we’re even nearer now. This man’s probably the most wonderful polymaths I’ve ever met in my life. Superior, hilarious man.
And I’ve discovered a lot about mass retail, the Walmarts, Targets and so forth. I’ve discovered a lot about how you need to play the politics and the Sport of Thrones with that. I’ve discovered about abroad manufacturing, I’ve discovered about, you identify it, proper? I’ve discovered a lot and people had been the explanations for me selecting this. And for those who have a look at, as an example, there’s a weblog publish individuals can discover without spending a dime, angel investing, like investing in early stage firms, which is like 90% of my web value, which I began properly earlier than I may “afford it.” There’s a weblog publish referred to as “Making a Actual World MBA,” which explains type of how I approached it, which was the identical means I approached this, studying and relationships that I feel will transcend that venture and snowball over time in order that it’s very laborious to lose long run.
However coming again to the sport itself, for those who’ve obtained children in-between the ages of, let’s say, it says 10 on the field, however actually it’s type of like age eight. In case your children are fairly sensible, like age 15, that is type of a no brainer. The sport works actually, rather well. Adults additionally actually prefer it. So, it’s not only for children, however for those who’ve obtained some children round or adults who don’t care being a bit goofy, then I feel it’s a very easy, enjoyable recreation that hopefully does one thing cognitive for people as properly. That was type of the aim. Coyote recreation. You could find it in all places.
Dan Harris: It’s at all times an unlimited pleasure to speak to you, Tim. And I do know you say no to most shit, so thanks for saying sure to this.
Tim Ferriss: Yeah, I like what you do, man. I like what you do. One in all my very shut associates who’s a professor at a really well-respected college had pains in his physique, this simply horrible, pervasive ache in joints in his physique for years and years. Began utilizing 10% Happier, meditating every single day. And it was like increase, inside 4 weeks, pains went away, loopy. I’ve some theories on that. I feel it’s truly could be synchronized respiratory and vagus nerve stimulation, however that’s a separate dialog. And I simply assume you’re very considerate and also you do a variety of good on the earth, and I simply get pleasure from hanging out. So, it’s at all times a pleasure to attach.
Dan Harris: Thanks. I actually admire that. Immensely truly.
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WHAT YOU’RE WELCOME TO DO: You might be welcome to share the under transcript (as much as 500 phrases however no more) in media articles (e.g., The New York Occasions, LA Occasions, The Guardian), in your private web site, in a non-commercial article or weblog publish (e.g., Medium), and/or on a private social media account for non-commercial functions, offered that you just embrace attribution to “The Tim Ferriss Present” and hyperlink again to the tim.weblog/podcast URL. For the sake of readability, media retailers with promoting fashions are permitted to make use of excerpts from the transcript per the above.
WHAT IS NOT ALLOWED: Nobody is permitted to repeat any portion of the podcast content material or use Tim Ferriss’ identify, picture or likeness for any business function or use, together with with out limitation inclusion in any books, e-books, e-book summaries or synopses, or on a business web site or social media web site (e.g., Fb, Twitter, Instagram, and so on.) that provides or promotes your or one other’s services or products. For the sake of readability, media retailers are permitted to make use of pictures of Tim Ferriss from the media room on tim.weblog or (clearly) license pictures of Tim Ferriss from Getty Pictures, and so on.
