00:00: Introduction with Nick Bent, CEO at upReach
01:27: Nick Bent’s CEO Shell Shedding second: errors
06:42: How do you method getting the suitable individuals round you for the laborious moments
13:29: Resetting tradition at upReach
16:59: One piece of studying recommendation from Nick Bent
19:04: Closing remarks
Sarah Ellis: Nick, thanks a lot for becoming a member of us on the Squiggly Careers podcast right now.
Nick Bent: Hello, Sarah. I am completely delighted to be right here. Thanks for having me.
Sarah Ellis: So that is a part of our particular CEO Shell Shedding Moments collection. I’ve to say that I’ve to practise that just a few occasions to ensure I say that proper. And I’m wondering if we might begin with you simply introducing your position, who you might be and what you achieve this that everyone’s sort of in control earlier than we dive straight into that shell shedding second.
Nick Bent: With pleasure, sure. So I am Nick Bent. I am the CEO of UpReach. I am celebrating my third anniversary within the job in the beginning of 2026. I joined in January 2023. I completely find it irresistible. At UpReach, we do some unimaginable work on social mobility. I’ve received a tremendous employees group and UpReach is among the main social mobility charities within the UK. And our particular mission at UpReach is to assist undergraduate college students from very deprived backgrounds, working class backgrounds, low earnings backgrounds, and assist them on their profession journey whereas they’re at college to allow them to get wonderful graduate jobs once they end their diploma.
Sarah Ellis: Okay, nice. So I believe each CEO job is difficult, however I believe being a CEO within the charity sector in the meanwhile might be significantly difficult. We all know there’s a lot of challenges round funding and uncertainty and ambiguity although. These are phrases that we hear all internationally. So, reflecting on you and the sort of the job that you simply do, what’s a shell shedding second that you’ve got had in your position as a CEO the place issues felt actually laborious, the place you maybe felt susceptible? We regularly describe how when the lobster does lose its laborious shell, it truthfully seems to be jelly. Like, you already know, you possibly can virtually see that. It is like, oh, it is simply received this second of feeling actually uncomfortable. It is vitality zapping. However in the end it is higher due to it. It grows again larger and stronger. However that, that shell shedding second is de facto powerful and it is simple for us from the surface in for me to have a look at you. And I used to be clearly I used to be doing my analysis beforehand and also you simply suppose, wow, Nick’s so spectacular, he should be good and every little thing should go swimmingly the entire time. So, I imply, if that’s true, that is going to be very brief, however hopefully you’ve got a shell shedding second to share with us.
Nick Bent: I do. There is a a lot, truly. So a few of the shell shedding moments for me and my senior management group have been round resetting the tradition at UpReach. So there was only a extra supportive and inclusive tradition for our group performing some main overhauls and funding in, in our know-how. I imply particularly, a shell shedding second for, for me normally includes know-how as a result of I am not excellent at know-how. I had one simply earlier than Christmas. The truth is, my ultimate Zoom name of 2025 was fairly an necessary name. It was with senior particular person at certainly one of our key companions. He was doing a handover to a brand new colleague. So the brand new particular person was going to steer on the connection with UpReach. And for some cause this, my laptop computer was glitching. They could not hear what I used to be saying correctly. It was, it was simply disastrous and it was actually embarrassing and I simply felt like an fool and I imply they had been very good about it, however it was fairly embarrassing for me and I hate messing up like that as a result of I really feel like I am letting the group down, letting the organisation down. Anyway, I used to be in a position to rescue it will definitely and ship good observe up emails and so forth. However yeah, one thing that felt out of my management at a vital second was actually disagreeable.
Sarah Ellis: We typically discuss, you already know, all people has mistake moments. Typically these mistake moments are simply your individual mistake. You understand, we’re all human and typically one thing out of your management simply, simply comes your means and also you’re having to take care of, you already know, sometimes like unanticipated stress and sort of stress like in, in that second and as you kind of described it like that, I believe all of us can viscerally really feel what it is, you already know, what it is like when know-how goes unsuitable as a result of it kind of occurred, occurred to all of us. However generally, as a CEO, once you’re in these moments, you already know, the place you, you are feeling like that is, this isn’t going properly. Whether or not it is one thing in your management or out of your management. What helps you, what helps you in that subsequent 24 hours, what lets you be taught reasonably than repeat these errors or maintain onto these errors? I assume.
Nick Bent: Yeah. I believe for me there’s this, there’s two key issues. So one is a way of function and the opposite is a way of perspective.
Sarah Ellis: Good.
Nick Bent: And the aim actually issues as a result of, you already know, you need to carry every little thing again to the why anyway. And I attempted to do this with the group at UpReach. Now we now have this, you already know, this huge formidable mission on social mobility. That is why everybody who works at upReach is there and is so devoted to that trigger. Nevertheless it’s typically it is good to explicitly remind your self that, you already know, you are on this for the suitable causes and also you’re making an attempt to attain a extremely worthwhile function. And you already know, and that signifies that, you already know, the laborious occasions, the troublesome occasions, the moments the place you mess up are nonetheless completely price it. And that is simply a part of regular working life. You understand, you simply should acknowledge that typically issues will go unsuitable and you’ve got uncomfortable, typically painful second. In order that sense of function is all the time, I believe, fairly restorative. And the sense of perspective additionally issues as a result of usually what could seem to be a horrendous factor to you might be not that dangerous. So speak to somebody about it, you already know, get their perspective on it they usually’ll most likely be pondering, you already know, why is he stressing about this? It is not that, that huge a deal. They’re going to be capable to give you a bit of non-public assist, possibly some concepts, some insights that may aid you discover, repair no matter it’s that is gone unsuitable or that you’ve got tousled. So I believe that, yeah, that sense of function, that centre of perspective are actually necessary for getting you thru these difficult moments.
Sarah Ellis: Yeah, I usually replicate on how distance offers you a distinct varieties of knowledge. You understand, once you’re in it. Like once you simply described, you might actually bear in mind and describe that second I used to be with this particular person and that this did not work. And we had been so good at remembering all the main points of when issues go unsuitable and infrequently not fairly so good at remembering all the main points of the issues, issues that go proper as a result of, you already know, we transfer, all of us transfer on, proper, you progress on to the following factor and also you suppose, oh, properly, how will we develop and the way will we get higher? And I believe that is usually simply, simply human nature. Do you will have sort of go to individuals, you already know, typically CEOs may speak concerning the significance of issues like mentoring or a private board or maybe leaders they’ve labored for earlier than. How do you method getting the suitable individuals round you so that they are there for the laborious moments? As a result of I assume you by no means know when the shell shedding moments are going to come back. However what you most likely can guess is that they may occur. You understand, like in each job. They’re inevitable due to the uncertainty and the anomaly and having the suitable individuals round us sort of feels necessary. So I used to be simply to know the way intentional are you about that, like how, how do you be sure to’ve received these individuals?
Nick Bent: Yeah, completely. I imply, I do suppose {that a} huge a part of with the ability to deal with these, these kind of shocks, these setbacks whether or not you are a CEO or anybody else within the skilled world is all the way down to your social capital. Form of how a lot social capital have you ever received professionally? How robust is your community of individuals that you would be able to draw on for recommendation and assist? All of us have kind of concentric circles of individuals round us, whether or not it is household and mates, individuals at work that we work with significantly intently. You understand, who you’ve got received a trusted relationship with. However typically you’ll want to faucet right into a broader community of individuals. Possibly you already know, any person who’s, who’s extra skilled and has been by way of related challenges earlier than that you simply occur to, you already know, you may need their quantity from 10 years in the past nonetheless in your cellphone, otherwise you join with them on LinkedIn and also you simply wish to choose their brains or actually have a espresso with them. I do. You understand, I do hunt down alternatives to construct my community, significantly of different CEO friends, each inside the charity sector and extra broadly. So once I’ve had the possibility to do, you already know, kind of management programs, coaching periods that contain my friends, I’ve all the time gone for that.
Sarah Ellis: I believe for anybody listening, possibly contemplating, you already know, who’s in your profession neighborhood. And likewise, do you will have a spread of individuals? As a result of truly listening to you, you talked about some issues then that had been most likely a bit extra structured. So that you’d requested your self virtually like, what do I wish to be taught, the place do I wish to be taught? And then you definitely’ve kind of discovered these sort of peer, peer to look relationships by way of these issues. However then a few of it’s extra casual from jobs you’ve got carried out or individuals you’ve got maybe labored with. And I believe when you will have a shell shedding second, it might really feel actually lonely and you’ll really feel actually remoted. And we additionally know that loneliness at work is rising and really that is not related to working at dwelling or working within the workplace, which is everybody’s preliminary assumption. It is truly far more about how related we really feel at work. So do I really feel again to your phrase about sort of purposeful? Do I really feel related to my work? Do I really feel like I’ve received individuals round me who care and who I might. I imply, nobody makes use of velocity dial anymore, however we used to name it your assist velocity dial. You understand, like who’s on. Whenever you’re having a shell shedding second, who’s in your assist velocity dial? And in the event you’re in the meanwhile pondering, oh, I am undecided then that that is okay too, however then that could be a little bit of a immediate to begin to consider simply how do I discover some like minded learners I see it within the squiggly careers neighborhood. We’re working one thing this week, an enormous open dash internationally and anytime somebody is getting caught or has a good suggestion, they’re all sharing it in a WhatsApp group. We’re doing nothing. I am, you already know, I am not, I am not being helpful. However they’re being so helpful for one another. And simply the quantity of studying and connection simply occurring in that group is, is unimaginable. Typically they’re fixing quick, typically, to your level, they’re doing, they’re doing a little bit of TLC. Typically somebody’s saying, oh, I am doing this on my own as a result of my organisation is not very into studying they usually’re getting a load of affection of like, properly, don’t be concerned, you possibly can be taught with us. And so individuals are sort of getting the issues that they want. And I all the time suppose, do not forget that asking for assistance is all the time an indication of energy and by no means a weak point.
Nick Bent: I utterly agree with that. I utterly agree with that. A lot of that is concerning the high quality of your relationships with different individuals that actually issues. It is all the time been necessary. It is nonetheless necessary now. I believe it is going to be necessary so long as human beings are round on this planet. And look, there are some wonderful and thrilling and typically scary issues occurring on this planet of know-how, significantly round AI. But when something, you already know, the kind of, the advance of AI into our, into our lives, whether or not that is working lives, private lives, makes the human relationships much more necessary. And I believe for younger individuals beginning off of their careers or center leaders or skilled leaders, simply remembering that the human relationships are so necessary is significant. You understand, these human centric abilities, being a great individuals particular person, being a great group participant, good communicator, even simply, you already know, frequent courtesy, good British manners, no matter, you might be good to individuals, no matter you wish to name it, it actually, actually issues and simply makes every little thing that bit simpler to take care of in knowledgeable context. I believe it is also necessary to do not forget that exactly as a result of careers are going to change into increasingly more squiggly over time, you by no means know when you are going to stumble upon individuals once more, individuals that you simply may work with in the identical workplace, or they could be a buyer or a provider or in a accomplice organisation, no matter it might be, your paths might cross a number of occasions and really the facility dynamics may very well be very completely different subsequent time round. So, I imply, only one instance from, for me, an upReach. So any person I used to work with in enterprise 25 years in the past has simply change into a trustee of UpReach. So she’s now certainly one of my bosses and I believe we received on effective, you already know, 25 years in the past, principally neither of us can bear in mind actually, however it appears to that, you already know, we had an amazing working relationship again then and that is only one instance of how individuals that you simply work with in your skilled life might maintain popping up once more in very completely different contexts.
Sarah Ellis: Yeah, and I, that has undoubtedly been true for me too. You understand, I work in a really completely different space now to a few of the groups and organisations that I’ve labored in prior to now. And but typically somebody will pop up on my LinkedIn and say, oh, we love squiggly careers. We take heed to your podcast, I bear in mind working for you, and I will be there pondering, proper, like, I’m wondering, I’m wondering, I’m wondering what that have was like. And normally such as you say, you, you might both you possibly can’t bear in mind or hopefully it was okay. However I do suppose, simply that be aware know that that squiggly serendipity is unquestionably, is unquestionably a factor.
Nick Bent: Yeah.
Sarah Ellis: You talked about sort of resetting tradition at Attain, which is all the time, that is virtually a shell shedding second for the organisation, reasonably than not only for sort of you individually, however virtually for everybody. And I am sort of to know, like, what helped individuals by way of that? As a result of letting go of a sort of an previous tradition, sort of determining what your new tradition seems to be like is sort of a tough process as a result of it is all about what you do, probably not about what you say. And it is sort of behaviour change, which we, for anybody who’s ever tried to offer something up, is all the time, everyone knows is tough. In order that was virtually like an organization shell shedding second. So what do you suppose helped all people? As a result of that may have felt completely different for everybody. It most likely would have felt uncomfortable. There may have been some tensions, most likely some uncomfortable truths that needed to be stated out loud. If I am sort of guessing, you already know.
Nick Bent: It is a collaborative effort. The tradition must be understood and owned by everybody within the organisation, no matter their position or which group or workplace they work in. So it is collaborative. However, you already know, as a CEO, you have to be intentional in saying that the tradition wants some work and we’ll sort of reset it collectively. You have to make it clear that you simply worth everybody’s voice and enter. One of many first issues I did as a CEO was to launch a employees survey. There’d by no means been a employees survey in outreach, an nameless employees survey. We have repeated yearly. And really that first employees survey gave individuals on the group a chance to vent anonymously. A few of them had some very difficult issues to say about, you already know, how they’d skilled working life upReach beforehand. Some individuals had been feeling fairly, you already know, sort of battered and bruised and wished some fairly dramatic change. And it was necessary that individuals might say that anonymously, understanding it will be heard and understanding that there’d be no, you already know, there’d be no kind of unfavorable penalties from them being so, so, so candid about, about their opinions. In order that was a extremely necessary a part of the method. And yeah, me making an actual effort to, to, to, to hear. I, once I got here in as a CEO, I stated, look, I have not received any secret plan to kind of shake issues up and make a lot of modifications within the first occasion. You understand, I wish to hear and be taught and simply, you already know, and construct on what’s good at upReach. However I all the time say, you already know, I need upReach to change into one of many perfect locations within the UK charity sector for individuals to, to work and to thrive professionally. The large mantra that I all the time use to sum up the tradition at upReach is excessive efficiency and excessive properly being. And holding these two issues, you already know, in tandem, you already know, in artistic stress is de facto necessary.
Sarah Ellis: That is actually fascinating and I believe it is a good remark that there is not any level the place you tick the tradition field and virtually if that is the way you see it, you’ve got most likely received it unsuitable, you already know, like, oh, we have carried out that now, tradition carried out. I believe the truth that you see it as like a continuous dedication and you have sort of received that mantra to maintain coming again to, which is a very nice, that is sort of received an and ness about it. I typically describe that as like, and agility. It is like two of these issues will be true on the identical time. You possibly can have excessive efficiency and excessive wellbeing and I believe typically individuals see these as commerce offs and whereas truly what you’ve got simply described, truly no, they’re complimentary. You understand, we’ll all be higher due to each of these issues. In case you had been to go away our listeners now with one bit of recommendation in the event that they wish to be taught extra from the work they do, however particularly in the event that they wish to discover their means by way of these shell shedding moments that, that all of us have the large ones, the small ones, those that possibly typically we create our personal shell shedding moments as a result of, you already know, possibly we, we’re a newbie or we select to do one thing for the primary time in our squiggly careers or typically they occur to us and we have got to seek out our means by way of. What do you wish to depart our listeners with right now?
Nick Bent: Yeah, so I believe embrace the challenges and see them as, you already know, alternatives to be taught and develop, however do not do it alone. You understand, it is actually necessary to speak to individuals. You understand, speak to individuals in your office. Possibly a few of your, you already know, some, a few of your friends on the senior management group, your, your line supervisor, or simply any person who you actually belief within the office who could be extra of a pal than a direct colleague. So embrace the challenges, however do not do it alone. I believe it is all the time helpful to do not forget that what could seem to be a extremely horrendous downside or actually huge deal to you might be not fairly as huge a deal as you think about. And likewise do not forget that individuals are usually extra charitable and extra good and extra supportive than you suppose they are going to be. So in the event you open up a couple of mistake you’ve got made or a dilemma or problem that you simply’re dealing with, likelihood is individuals are going to be going to be useful and that is going to make it higher reasonably than making it worse. You understand, working life just isn’t just like the Thick of It or Home of playing cards the place individuals are searching for you to make a mistake in order that they will exploit that and cynically use it towards it. In actual life, an issue shared is usually an issue halved.
Sarah Ellis: Nicely, the Thick of It’s certainly one of my favorite TV programmes, however I’m very glad that that isn’t my each day actuality. And I believe your two factors that you’ve got kind of bolstered there on when one thing goes unsuitable, bear in mind your function and get some perspective. I believe that’s actually going to stay with me. So, Nick, thanks a lot for our dialog right now. I actually respect you taking the time to share your insights and your concepts and your experiences with all our listeners. So thanks a lot.
Nick Bent: My absolute pleasure. Thanks.
