00:00: Introduction with Logan McClure Davda, CEO at TED
02:35: What a day within the life appears like as a CEO at TED
05:02: Leaving TED to work on the Obama Basis
11:17: Logan’s CEO Shell Shedding second: letting go
17:42: Logan’s recommendation for shell shedding moments
19:26: Closing remarks
Sarah Ellis: Hello everybody, it is Sarah right here from the Squiggly Careers podcast. This week it’s the launch of our new e book, Study Like a Lobster. So we have got some very particular podcast episodes for you. Every day you’ll hear me discuss to a CEO about one in all their shell shedding moments. One thing onerous that has occurred, what’s helped them, and the way they’ve discovered their approach to rising even greater, higher and stronger, similar to our new pal and position mannequin, the lobster. And I actually hope you take pleasure in listening to from the vary of CEOs that you will get the chance to study from this week. CEOs who run large artistic firms, who run quick rising scale ups, charities, volunteer organisations, and even our very personal Helen, who’s our CEO, may also be speaking about her shell shedding moments. So I hope you take pleasure in every of the conversations and should you’ve bought any suggestions or reflections, we all the time love to listen to from you
Logan, thanks a lot for becoming a member of me on the Squiggly Careers podcast. I am actually trying ahead to our dialog as we speak.
Logan McClure Davda: Sarah, it is such a pleasure to be with you. Thanks for having me.
Sarah Ellis: So for our listeners or viewers who may not know, tell us, the place are you a CEO? Perhaps how lengthy have you ever been a CEO? And provides us a little bit of an perception into your day. I’ve form of stopped asking for, oh, what is the day within the lifetime of a CEO? As a result of clearly they’re all the time totally different, however perhaps what was as we speak been like or what was yesterday like? Give us a window into your world.
Logan McClure Davda: Completely happy to. So I’m CEO of TED, the nonprofit devoted to sharing concepts that spark curiosity, foster connection and drive significant change. In all probability most well-known for the TED Speak, however we really are a a lot bigger organisation than that, engaged on quite a lot of actually essential matters and programmes and methods of bringing folks collectively and sharing essential, credible pursuits, insightful, inspiring concepts with the world. I’m a brand new CEO. I stepped into the position on October sixteenth of 2025. So I am three and a half months into the position and in addition it appears like yesterday I stepped into it. And beforehand I used to be head of Impression at TED. I’ve spent really the vast majority of my profession at TED. I used to be, I based the fellowship programme right here, Many Moons, left and did different issues after which got here again in 2019 to step into the pinnacle of impression position.
What does a day within the life seem like? I imply, I am certain everybody has answered this query that day by day is a bit of bit totally different and I spend lots of my day assembly with others each internally and externally and co-creating issues with my colleagues in lots of a Google Docs. We’re on the Google Suite. I do know you guys are on the Groups suite from a podcast of yours that I hearken to and it is actually a mixture. I admire the best way I get to work together with the surface world and take into consideration massive methods through which TED exhibits up. In order that’s been an actual pleasure to type of assume creatively about new issues we might be doing with like minded entities out within the wider world. That was the spotlight of my day yesterday. I had a extremely invigorating dialog with somebody dreaming up one thing new and we had been type of screaming at each other over zoom, which was, which was so cup filling. After which, you recognize, a few of my day is spent on wrestling with inside challenges and alternatives. So I am deep as a result of I am new within the position. I am deep in technique and price range work proper now. And in order that’s an enormous focus of mine. It is a mixture of every part.
Sarah Ellis: Let’s now dive in to those shell shedding moments. A lot of our listeners will know as a result of we’ve been speaking about studying like a lobster a short while now and really this episode will come out the day after our e book launches within the UK. It is out a few weeks later within the US. So let’s hope like a lot of listeners and viewers have really bought the e book in of their palms as we discuss and they’re going to begin to be studying about this concept of lobsters shell that shed their shells and that’s how they continue to grow and that is not a straightforward course of. It is power zapping. The lobsters are weak however they develop again these new shells and they’re greater, higher, stronger due to it. And so we expect all people has shell shedding moments of their careers. In all probability we’ve many shell shedding moments most days or most weeks. And the rationale we notably needed to speak to CEOs is I generally assume it is simple to place people who find themselves in positions with a lot affect and impression on, on a pedestal and assume Logan should not have shell shedding moments as a result of she’s the CEO of TED and TED’s unimaginable. So I might love to listen to an instance or a few examples of what has these shell shedding moments appeared like for you?
Logan McClure Davda: The primary one was I used to be at TED, left, labored in tech after which I went to the Obama Basis. And as you may think about, it was a spotlight of my profession to work so intently with President Obama as he constructed the muse. And I used to be there constructing our type of programmes and convenings. However so one of many hardest issues I’ve ever needed to do is definitely selecting to go away the Basis. , in some ways it was a dream job. I used to be making use of an space of experience that I had honed. , I used to be constructing a fellowship programme which I had accomplished in different areas. I used to be constructing our type of convening functionality and it was a extremely essential subject that we had been engaged on. And naturally I started working actually intently with the President himself.
So after a few yr and a half, it felt prefer it was my time to go away. And it was a mixture of issues that had been contributing to that, one in all which was the power of the Basis wanted to be centered on constructing the Presidential Centre in Chicago. However I actually felt like I used to be leaving the work half completed and I used to be in the course of deciding on the second class of fellows after which type of my sense of responsibility to the fellows themselves who’re simply these badass human beings out on the planet. And I needed to catapult them additional of their careers, you recognize, develop the impression they had been having. My dedication to the workforce engaged on these items. After which in fact my inside monologue that by leaving, solely having been there for a yr and a half, I used to be failing and what would the surface world consider that? All of that was actually like loud in my head as I used to be wrestling with the choice. And I believe in the end it was my great husband Justin who mentioned to me, Logan, the one particular person or the particular person, I do not keep in mind how he mentioned it. He could have mentioned it extra eloquently than I’ll say to you, however one thing alongside the traces of, you’re all the time going to be the one that’s searching most on your profession and your wellbeing. And if this feels such as you assume it is likely to be proper, then it in all probability is and it is price taking that danger, even when you’ve got issues about why you should not be taking that leap. And so I finally did it and I did it my manner. I gave them six months lead time so I might actually really feel like I used to be closing out the issues that I needed to shut out. And honestly, I believe most of us do keep in jobs too lengthy as a result of it is actually onerous to go away particularly excessive performers and Sort A personalities and all. I do know you speak about that stuff lots on the podcast and as I used to be reflecting on it, it feels prefer it’s a mixture of ego and empathy, type of that make you keep too. And it is not in service of the organisation you are at to remain too lengthy, not to mention your self. And so determining methods to shed that ego and empathy to make the suitable determination in that second for myself, however for others, that was an enormous studying for me that I, you recognize, I believe I nonetheless wrestle with shedding these in sure moments, however really feel very rewarded by that call that I made. Realizing that it in the end was proper, that offers me extra type of confidence to make selections like sooner or later.
Sarah Ellis: I do wonder if, simply listening to you there, I believe if you’re having these massive moments, as a result of it is a massive determination to make and you’ll in all probability justify it both manner, you would provide you with the professionals and cons and you would get to A or you would get to B, nevertheless it seemed like in all probability what you wanted in that second. I do wonder if we all the time want perspective from someone exterior of our scenario. The opposite reflection you had there, which really I believe is, it is a form of smaller, nuanced perception that I do not assume I’ve heard as usually. So I simply needed to, to pause on that was you mentioned one thing like, and I nonetheless assume I am, I am shedding components of that shell. And I believe that is fairly reassuring for folks to listen to that. I assume generally if you think about this, as a result of we’re speaking about lobsters, they shed their shell and you are like, oh, that is accomplished. As a result of then, you recognize, they type of develop. I imply, to be honest, they eat them in order that they, they actually do disappear as a result of they have calcium. So it helps them to develop their new shells. However I believe that is the place perhaps, you recognize, generally we do not take the parallels with the lobster too far as a result of really I believe for us it’s, it is not a form of one and accomplished course of. And the way about in your, in your position now as a type of CEO, I’m actually to listen to about perhaps one thing that is simply felt both prefer it’s been surprisingly onerous or simply, simply felt robust for you it is maybe felt such as you’ve needed to, you recognize, we have needed to do a little bit of unlearning and relearning. I usually assume with shell shedding – there have to be a bit for you of letting go of that type of previous job, your previous roles and tasks and type of going, I now want to determine, what does it imply now that I am the CEO. It is not the identical. It type of cannot be the identical. However that should additionally really feel fairly onerous at occasions.
Logan McClure Davda: I used to be speaking about this earlier than we began the recording, however your podcast on spaciousness, to not plug one other of your podcasts, had me enthusiastic about this lots, as a result of the distinction between spaciousness and doing, I believe, was a number of the dichotomy that you simply had been speaking about, Sarah. And in some ways, clearly I used to be main a giant workforce and work beforehand, however I am actually assured and excel within the doing. And in some ways I am unable to personally be doing as a lot doing within the CEO. And so enthusiastic about methods to help, belief others and spend money on type of fertile floor for us to do the most effective work going ahead has been a part of that shift, I believe, and a steady shift. I imply, it is not. I have never shifted, I believe all the time be on that journey shifting. I used to be additionally enthusiastic about type of like, what are some small examples of shell shedding moments that I’ve skilled up to now couple of weeks and months. And one involves thoughts, I used to be getting ready to share, I discussed we’re doing type of some technique work and a few price range work as we take into consideration type of moving into this subsequent chapter with me as CEO and Sal Khan as our imaginative and prescient steward. The 2 of us are type of main us into this subsequent part of TED. And I have been working with our management workforce, enthusiastic about what’s the type of technique that’s going to finest place us to have the best impression that we must always and will have within the wider world. And the workforce has type of come collectively in a fantastic approach to do nice work on that. And there was a query of – I used to be asking myself of type of when to carry the board into that course of. As I used to be in my inside monologue, as I used to be reflecting on when is the suitable time to carry them in, I realised that I had been delaying virtually bringing them in. And I did not know why at first, proper? I used to be type of pondering like, “what’s that? Why am I delaying this?” And I actually type of dug deep. And at first I assumed it was like, oh, it is not prepared, it is not prepared, it must be additional alongside after which I will share it. However as I mirrored and dug deeper to the type of root reason behind that feeling inside me that was inflicting me to delay it was that I used to be anxious they had been going to disagree. Proper. Or they had been going to assume the work was, was fallacious or totally different. And as quickly as I got here to that conclusion it was like, oh, effectively, I must. If that is the case, if that is going to be their response, if that is the worst, I must get that enter now in order that we are able to transfer ahead. And so I do not know the way perhaps to summarise the shell shedding second aside from to say the type of actually attending to that root trigger of what is inflicting the problem or behaviour is so essential in my work. And I’ve discovered that I work with an unimaginable coach who is useful as a result of I am a verbal learner in some ways. That is not a phrase. And so I discuss issues out and it is virtually simply the act of reflecting on it in dialog with, with my coach that I used to be like, oh wait, I would like to simply do that instantly and that may allow me to us to maneuver ahead.
Sarah Ellis: Yeah, it is fascinating, is not it? I believe lots of shell shedding moments is usually about letting go of one thing and should you can determine, effectively, what’s it that I am holding on to, then it usually turns into simpler to determine, effectively, what wouldn’t it take to let go of it?
Logan McClure Davda: Sure, I like that.
Sarah Ellis: And I believe for all of us that is totally different. And you recognize, for some folks listening, they will go, it will likely be one thing to do with like perfectionism. For a few of folks it will be as a result of they simply care, however to the extent the place they are going, yeah, but when I care a lot, I am unable to let go of it. Like I try this generally. Like, I discovered one in all my form of massive modifications from working for giant firms to working for myself is I cared earlier than. I all the time thought I actually cared earlier than, however you actually care when it is your individual firm. And so generally I simply actually, I actually battle to simply let it go. And that wasn’t a form of virtually a attribute that I might seen in myself till I used to be in a brand new context. And I believe that is additionally fascinating with just like the transition you’ve got made into your position is, I believe, you recognize, the setting we’re in, the position that we’re doing. Shell shedding can appear and feel totally different. And one of many issues I all the time assume is actually useful for folks to consider is shell shedding moments are inevitable. It does not matter what stage of your profession you are at, what position you are in, what trade you’re employed in. Everybody’s going to have these shell shedding moments of their Squiggly Profession and also you often cannot anticipate precisely when they’ll occur or what they are going to be as a result of usually, you recognize, usually they’re out of our management. They usually do type of simply come our manner. However I do assume maybe you may construct some habits or take some actions that then provide help to. I generally consider it as like your resilience reserves. So when the shell shedding second occurs, you are like, okay, however I’ve, I’ve form of been investing in myself up to now and it is not going to make it utterly straightforward, nevertheless it would possibly make it extra. It would make it simpler, it would make it simpler to deal with. What are a number of the issues that you simply do like as a CEO to form of take care of your power, your resilience, your wellbeing? As a result of I sense from listening to you you’ve got considered that and also you form of take that critically.
Logan McClure Davda: There’s so some ways to reply it. One I believe is the folks you encompass your self with. Whether or not you name them, you recognize, some folks name it their private board of administrators, some folks name it their workforce. I’ve all the time referred to as it my workforce. The folks cheering me on in life. And I really feel so grateful. I, I have been pondering lots about type of like how I lucked out to have such an unimaginable group of people round me after which, you recognize, I’m additionally such a believer in teaching. I’ve labored with totally different coaches in my life and every one in all them has reworked considerably impacted my trajectory in massive and small methods. And I am so grateful to every of them for type of serving to me navigate.
Sarah Ellis: Yeah, it is very actually fascinating. I believe one of many watch outs that I usually discuss to folks about of their careers is individuals are so good at constructing the relationships that they want for his or her day jobs, however not so good at constructing the relationships they want for his or her growth. And so they, they type of deep that will get deprioritised as a result of everybody’s dedicated and so they’re working onerous and you recognize, everybody’s in demanding jobs. After which I will form of, I’ll usually ask folks as a part of a workshop or a programme, you recognize, do you are feeling such as you’ve bought the suitable folks round you, such as you mentioned your workforce or nonetheless you need to describe it. And I will get folks doing a little bit of an train or a spot evaluation being like, okay, so should you’ve bought somebody who does this, somebody who challenges you, somebody who takes a training strategy, ask us good questions, is a extremely, you recognize, an insightful listener. And infrequently that is the place folks will then say to me, oh, I realise perhaps I’ve bought my buddies or my household, however really virtually past that, I form of have not actually invested in, in myself. And so similar to listening to you, one of many issues that I believe you are able to do, everybody might do proper now, prepared for any shell shedding second which may come your manner is like, begin investing, getting the suitable folks round you. And the final query we’re asking all of our CEOs is what’s one piece of recommendation you’d give to our listeners if they’re in a shell shedding second proper now? What would you need to go away folks with?
Logan McClure Davda: For me personally, I usually maintain the shell shedding second to myself. , sure, I’ve an unimaginable neighborhood round me and I do not all the time keep in mind and I is likely to be sharing it with them, however I is probably not sharing it with the particular person I am most afraid to share the shell shedding second with, if that is smart. And I’ve discovered that one of many unlocks to maneuver via it’s to call the second and the problem to the person who I am most afraid to call it to, in order that I do not really feel like I am carrying it alone. And that, in some context, is your boss to say, “I am anxious, not hitting this goal or ending this factor in time” or what have you ever, or it is to your peer since you’re anxious about letting them down or simply somebody in your private life for, for one more cause. However identify it and share it.
Sarah Ellis: Yeah, I believe that is the genius in that recommendation. Like say it to the particular person you are scared to say it to as a result of that is what’s going to cease. That is what begin will begin to type of construct that new shell that may actually provide help to. Logan, thanks a lot. I do admire, as a CEO who’s form of nonetheless actually, in that first three months, you might have a lot to do and taking the time to share your phrases of knowledge, your insights, your concepts with our listeners. I am actually grateful. I do know folks have actually loved listening and watching, so thanks a lot.
Logan McClure Davda: Oh, Sarah, it is a pleasure. Thanks, Sarah.
